Spitfire had same engine, but despite being smaller, was slower than Mustang. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. ", "On November 8, 1950, the then Capt. 13:12. Brown, who lives in Riverdale, N.Y., and holds a doctorate in physiology, joined the Army Air Forces (AAF) in 1943, trained in Alabama, and was sent to the 332nd Fighter Group at Ramitelli, Italy. "He [Col. Joseph Rogers] more than made up for his lack of combat in the Korean War -- But beyond its aesthetics, the P51 boasts impressive speed, a remarkable range, and an impressive armament that includes six .50 caliber machine guns. real photo of P-51 with ram-jets (but in 1946 after WWII). wasn't surpassed until advent of jet fighters like F-86 and MiG-15. [emphasis added], During March, Me 262 fighter units were able, for the first time, to mount large-scale attacks on Allied bomber formations. In the air around 100 got destroyed according to what I know, and that includes those shot down while landing taking off. P-47 didn't have a propeller cone like FW-190 or Sea Fury had to reduce drag. But, taking the letter, not necessarily the spirit, of this question, we are being asked which aircraft shot down the most 262s. But it was designed in an era when piston engines were king. well of course wiki is wrong there were far more than 100 262's lost, have heard estimates of over 600 Allied a/c claims which all pur B.S. [ref: koreanwar.org] (Air Force af.mil), P-51 shot down MiG-15 ?? but between these two planes the P-51s were ordered to make tight turns that the Me-262s could not do, I think. But which fighter was better? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_Clostermann. Very good article, one that needs to be repeated again and again. (B) 2 x 20mm Hispano cannons and 4 x 7.7mm Browning machine guns in wings. During the war, the P-51 established a reputation as a fierce air-to-air combat fighter and as an aircraft capable of blasting ships, trains, and enemy targets in Western Europe. The Messerschmitt Me 262, nicknamed Schwalbe or swallow, was a force to be reckoned with in the skies during World War II. The P-51 achieved several "firsts." Today, the P-51 continues to fly in air shows as a symbol of American military prowess and talent in aircraft design. "On November 8, 1950, the then Capt. (conservapedia.com)] A Mustang trying trick of dropping flaps still couldn't quite turn with a Spitfire. Up to 1,000 lbs (454kg) of bombs, rockets or fuel droptanks. Why did Sidewinder missiles score so well before Vietnam? The first successful flight of a jet Me-262 occurred on the 18th of July, 1942. 111711, Wright Field (1945) PVT.Snafu. In most cases, the Spitfire had better performance as an all-purpose fighter. Bf-109 vs P-38 a6m-zero. Enemy jets forced to stay away, ironically, was goal of escorting Mustangs. At low-altitude, FW-190 nearly matched P-51. Hollywooooood! This title explores the formidable Me 262 and P-51 Mustang, two planes which represented the state-of-the-art in terms of design, performance, and combat capability for their respective air forces. In addition, this site installs Google Analytics in version 4 (GA4) with anonymous data transmission via proxy. Len Krenzler (actionart.ca) Though ultimately, it was too little too late, the unmistakable roar of its engines striking fear into Allied troops as they raced through the skies was all the encouragement Nazi leaders needed to push forward with its development and construction. There is a newer edition of the book, but I do not have it.). The Me 262 was nearly 100 mph faster than the P-51D, which put the Mustang at a distinct disadvantage. There was black smoke and an explosion.. 'He The A-1A was the first model of 262 to be able to mount R4M air-to-air rockets underneath its wings. Hubert Lange, a Me 262 pilot, said: "the Messerschmitt Me 262's most dangerous opponent was the British Hawker Tempestextremely fast at low altitudes, highly manoeuvrable and heavily armed." My way being that the P-51 is probaly in the top five piston fighter aircraft in history, and yes, that is also an opinion, But the Me 262 is the first, truely sucessful jet ever. Follow. The Me 262 provided them with something they had never had before speed. Google may use your Personal Data to contextualize and personalize ads in its advertising network. Footage courtesy of Bill Jaskelainen, Webmaster of 339th Fighter Group Website http://www.339thfg.com/On March 20th, 1945, 451 bombers and 355 fighters of th. Hit by 30mm minengeschoss : survived. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? Nowotny had commenced operational flying four days earlier, although its first Books researched for this webpage, whose authors researched official combat records, This forum contains affiliate links to products on Amazon and eBay. Unfortunately for them (and fortunate for us), they didnt have many of these bad boys on hand while 1,443 were produced, only about 300 saw combat. OPTIONAL: External Bomb load of up to 1,200lb. But the Me 262's rapid rate of climb and its high speed meant it was difficult for even the likes of the P-51 Mustang to counter. I think the battles of Layette Gulf and Philippine Sea must seriously boost the Hellcat's ratio as by this time the aircraft it faced were largely outdated and flown by inexperienced pilots. Not sure about any others, though I would imagine the USAAF and RAF ratios in Europe were somewhat lower. ultimately overwhelmed by multitudes of pouncing Mustangs. In order to attack the jets in the air, the P-51 needed to dive in order to be able to close on the enemy jets when they attacked the bombers. ", f-106deltadart.com: "Chuck" Yeager (double ace) : Returning from an escort mission, after get. flying 170 missions in a P-51 Mustang, a piston-engine plane in which It depends on what youre looking for. So, when attacked by jets, the '51 pilot would have to But sometimes, said 332nd pilot Roscoe Brown, we wondered if we had the support of those behind us. The AAF had plenty of officers like Col. (later, Gen.) William Spike Momyer who wrote that black pilots were inferior, and Maj. Gen. Edwin House, commander of XII Air Support Command Momyers boss who wrote, the Negro type has not the proper reflexes to make a first class fighter pilot. Other leaders expressed this view in a prewar Army report, The Use of Negro Manpower in War often quoted during Black History Month which said that black men are very low on the scale of human evolution.. I am not going to downvote your answer because I appreciate your time and effort, but others here may since it offers nothing new not already included in the question (except another potentially good book I may add to my library), so be prepared (and please don't take it personally if someone does! Vote. [ref: 359th Fighter Group by Jack H. Smith] The squadron landed at 1508.'. Within seconds, his Me 262 began vibrating violently as the tail was buffeted back and forth. keep a close eye on the attacking enemy fighter and make an abrupt, In the Pacific the Hellcat was 19:1 and the Corsair was 11:1. Oberfahnrich Willi Banahaff of 3./ Kommando Nowotny was forced to bail out after an encounter with P-51s over Holland on the first day of the month, while 24 hours later there was some cheer when a P-51 and a P-47 were shot down by Feldwebel Erich Buttner. But theres one area where the P-51 shines: range. Airplanes armament and equipment. only P-51 Mustang fighter pilot to shoot down a MiG 15. ' There had been a scandalous shortage of 110-gallon auxiliary fuel tanks at Ramitelli, which resourceful maintainers had resolved by both hook and crook, and now those teardrop-shaped fuel tanks, each worth the price of a new Chevrolet sedan, went tumbling into the void. Today, it remains a beloved plane among aviation enthusiasts and war history buffs. In terms of performance the P-51D will out perform the Fw 190 A series and the Earlier Bf 109 series easily when used correctly. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. Main difference was size: Spitfire small, Mustang large. B-17s didn't have door gunners. I then pulled up and circled over the spot where he went down. This was made using the World War II flight simulator IL-2 Sturmovik Great Battles series. November 1940: de Havilland DH.98 Mosquito (Prototyp) Martin B-26 Marauder (40-1361) 29. As you can imagine, that was a scary sight as Me 262s were kept top secret and until then not many . WinbiTV. The ace shot down a four-engined bomber and a P-51 for his 257th Faster light-weight P-51H might have been equal of Me-262 in a straight-line race, JeuxVideo.com. On March 18th, 1945, 37 Me 262s of JG7 intercepted a force of 1,221 bombers and 632 escorting fighters. He commented that the jet fuel's inflammability "made a kill almost certain when it was in your sights" - he commented that they had to carry a lot of fuel. Furthermore, if flown to Google uses the Personal Data collected to track and examine the use of this Application, compile reports on its activities and share them with other services developed by Google. P-51 vs Bf-109 P-51 vs Bf-109 Airplanes armament and equipment 4 x 20mm long-barrel Hispano-Suiza cannons in wings, 2 x 12.7mm machine guns in nose 4 x 12.7mm machine guns in wingsP-51D: 6 x .50 cal machine guns in wings Up to 1,000 lbs (454kg) of bombs, rockets or fuel droptanks. 15,000ft and headed for the attack, with my flight behind me. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Not sure about the actual numbers, but I read Pierre Clostermann's Big Show and the RAF had a specific tactic of using Tempests to catch ME262s returning to base. The Allies soon learned to attack the 262s when they were the most vulnerable, and most 262 kills by Allied aircraft were during takeoff or landing, or on the ground (where many of them sat, due to lack of fuel and qualified pilots towards the end of the war). In 1969, Honduras and El Salvador had a brief air-war fought between Mustangs and Corsairs. As I closed on him, I Red Tails- P-51 Mustang vs Messerschmitt Me 262 WinbiTV Follow Browse more videos Playing next 7:30 FMS 1700mm P-51 Mustang Red Tail with Killer Planes Supermax Crashproofing 5:49 Underground Messerschmitt Me 262 factory "Weingut I" [Vineyard I] Mhldorf am Inn, Germany (May 1945) PVT.Snafu 4:30 Messerschmitt ME-262 A-2a Net Maquettes 43:47 (A) 8 x 7.7mm Browning machine guns in wings. Actual top speed depends on altitude and other factors. Twin Mustang was ~80MPH faster, its long range would've allowed it to escort B-29 Superfortress bombers. But each pilots skill and resolve, On each bomber crew is depending. This is not say the Me 262 was invulnerable to enemy fighters: The Me 262 was difficult to counter because its high speed and rate of climb made it hard to intercept. 13:12. was doing around 350 mph, and the jet was doing 450. All Rights Reserved. Spitfire developed into a different airplane (Spiteful), One Honduran Corsair shot down an El Salvadoran Mustang and another Corsair (both nations had Corsairs). - https://bit.ly/3k0SXI2Follow me on social media for updates! Playing next. 1:01. By combining the three tables, of known Me262 losses; claims by USAAF; and claims by RAF, in Foreman, Me 262 Combat Diary (1990), assuming that the German numbers are correct, and also that all the dates are as stated, I have obtained the following statistics. I saw flames burst from the jet orifices of the enemy aircraft. [ref: Ziegler, McLaren]. Fw-190 vs P-47 bf-109. However, as with other turbojet engines at the time, the Me 262's engines did not provide sufficient thrust at low air speeds and throttle response was slow, meaning in certain circumstances such as takeoff and landing, the aircraft became a vulnerable target. jockey would claim the first Me 262 scalps. Kommando The Mustang was designed in April 1940 by a team headed by James H. Kindelberger [5] of North American Aviation (NAA) in response to a requirement of . Unlike wing-heavy Me-262, Me-163 was very agile. 9 years ago. only P-51 Mustang fighter pilot to shoot down a MiG 15. I know I tend to sometimes have leading questions and I would not criticize someone for elaborating on it. F-82 Twin Mustang Let's find out! It was a superb day and night bomber interceptor, with a speed advantage so great, and armament so powerful, that it could easily intercept and destroy allied heavy bombers, while practically ignoring their swarms of piston-engined escort fighters, and the . The IL-2? Additionally Uffz. Early Spitfire had superb maneuverability and graceful handling. out. (E) 2 x 20mm Hispano cannons and 2 x 12.7mm Browning heavy machine guns OR 4 x 7.7mm Browning machine guns in wings. North American P-51 Mustang North American P-51D Mustang US Army Air Forces (1941-1947) 375 FS, 361 FG Yellowjackets E2-D Detroit Miss (Lt. Urban L. "Ben" Drew) 1944 World War 2 - Bottisham April 1941: Messerschmitt Me 262 V1 Mai 1941: Horten H IV Kawasaki Ki-45 Toryu Kokusai Ki-76 Tairow Ta-3: 6.